Friday, October 11, 2019

Does the USTA's 3-strike DQ system work? Looking at DQ's after Nationals

Those that follow USTA League know that there is a process in place for new players to self-rate based on playing history, but to help ensure this process is not abused there is a 3-strike DQ system to identify players that may have self-rated too low and proactively promote them to the next higher level.

Note that the system identifies strikes when a players rating exceeds a level dependent threshold.  The USTA does not disclose what the threshold are (although I have a pretty good idea) but does say they are higher than just the top of the level the player is playing at.  For example, the top of the range for a 3.5 player is 3.50, but they may not get a strike unless their rating exceeds, say 3.75.  This is done to allow players to have some natural improvement without being "punished" with disqualification and promotion.  And a fair number of at-level computer rated players will improve during the year too so having some self-rates still eligible with similar ratings isn't all that out of whack.

Now, the system does "work", it will routinely DQ and promote a number of players each year, but does it really work well?

One measure of working well would be that any out of level players are identified and deemed ineligible prior to Nationals.  While players are not DQ'd during Nationals, if they've accumulated 3-strikes at the end of any Nationals event, they can be DQ'd and promoted then.

I would posit that if a player is DQ'd after they play at Nationals, then the system didn't work as that player that has proven to be clearly above level and you'd expect the system to determine that before they get to an event as important as Nationals and get to lay waste to rules abiding opponents that likely have no shot against the clearly above player.

Additionally, if a self-rate is double bumped at year-end but was not DQ'd prior to Nationals, I'd argue that is a failure of the system too.

I'm sure not everyone will disagree with the above statement, but lets go with it and see if the system "failed" after one weekend of Nationals.

There have been some players marked as DQ'd/promoted that played at Nationals, and by the following Friday I'd hope any that were DQ'd have been reflected, and as of the writing of this, three players were DQ'd after playing at Nationals.

One player from New England was DQ'd, they went undefeated all year losing only one set, including 2-0 at Nationals.  Now going undefeated does not necessarily mean a player should be or have been DQ'd, they may have played weak opponents.  And my ratings for this player show they likely didn't have more than one strike until their Sectionals, but arguably could have gotten their third there (it was very close).  But they did get their 3rd strike at Nationals with my ratings showing all their Nationals matches played rated two levels above the level they were playing!  If someone can do that, they probably shouldn't have been playing at the level they were and the system should have caught that.

Another player from SoCal was DQ'd, they went undefeated in 18+ until Nationals where they lost one match in the semis.  They did lose two Tri-Level matches during the year, but had half of their Nationals matches rate two levels above the level they were playing and they very well could be double bumped.  My ratings also say they perhaps should have been DQ'd prior to Nationals but they weren't.

The third from Missouri Valley was DQ'd, they went 5-1 at Nationals with half their matches rating two levels above the one they were playing, and my ratings similarly say they should have been DQ'd prior to Nationals but they weren't.  They are also a borderline double bump candidate.

So here we have three players the system did not catch that my ratings say should have been, two may be double bumped, and the USTA 3-strike DQ system did not flag them and make them ineligible.  Why not?

Note that none of these players clearly tanked matches, so it isn't like they gamed the system to avoid strikes and suddenly turned it on at Nationals.  They did well at Nationals, but had done well during the year too.

It is possible the strike threshold is higher than I think it is and that is why they didn't get strikes.  If so, I'd suggest the threshold is significantly too high.  Shouldn't players who can play several individual matches with ratings two levels higher be flagged as ineligible sooner.  And they all had similarly high rated results during the year.

It is possible that my ratings are too high and I'm making a big deal out of nothing.  But when these players were undefeated or nearly so, the only losses being to other questionable players, I don't think it is "nothing".

Did the players perhaps accumulate 3-strikes but it was swept under the rug?  I doubt this, as while strikes in local league and district/state/sectional playoffs are managed by local staff, I'd think National staff would review eligibility for Nationals and anything would be caught there.

Now, for 2020 the USTA has instituted a new rule to try and preclude teams from "hiding" self-rates and appeals and qualifying them for Nationals with few matches played, but it is important to note that all of these players played 12, 6, and 10 matches respectively, well over the new rule's 4 requirement, so the new rule would have had no impact on their eligibility.

What do you think?  Is this a problem?  Is someone being DQ'd after Nationals an indication the system is broken?  Should the system have found players like the three above ineligible prior to Nationals?  Is the strike threshold too high if players like these can make their way through to Nationals?

15 comments:

  1. Just guessing, but maybe Nationals were among the only times these players faced very strong opponents that allowed them to show how good they were? How many of those 6-12 pre-Nationals matches provided a reasonable "opportunity" for a strike? If some were against low-end opponents then maybe even a 6-0, 6-0 win would not get to the threshold, since that is not far from expectation for a high-end vs. low-end, in-level match-up. Other opponents maybe required something like 6-1, 6-1 or better to get to the threshold, but it's easy to lose a few more games just by losing intensity after building a lead. And maybe some of them were doubles matches with a strong partner, where maybe it's even rarer to get a strike opportunity?

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    1. All valid comments, but each player's matches prior to Nationals included multiple matches at States/Districts/Sectionals, in fact, they each had 4, 6, and 3 respectively played at Sectionals which should have been mostly at least against stronger competition.

      But more importantly, as I noted in my write-up, my ratings had each of these players with at least three strikes prior to Nationals. Yes, my ratings aren't perfect, but there was ample indication these players were well above level and the USTA's ratings or thresholds didn't catch them.

      Also note the strike threshold I'm using is one so high that it is closer to two levels higher than the level they were playing at, e.g. if they were a 3.5, their ratings prior to Nationals were all closer to 4.5 than 3.5.

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    2. Are your threshold estimates entirely based on matching your estimates to who did and didn't get a three-strike DQ in previous years? If so, it does seem like your model is suggesting that something has changed in 2019, right? Does your model have any errors in the other direction - i.e. has anyone gotten a DQ this year that your model did not agree with?

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    3. There are always exceptions where I miss by a bit, these fall into that category but are all oddly at Nationals.

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  2. This is definitely a problem, and I suspect it happens much more often than you indicate -- for instance, the dq'ed player from SoCal lost 6-2 6-0 to a self-rated player who is not listed as being dq'ed, even though he only lost 11 games while winning 60 at singles at nationals. Surely this other player also has more than three strikes, and likely many other players have more than three strikes as well, but apparently tennislink only changes ratings after nationals in cases where the player is still playing on other teams in the same ratings year. My reaction is twofold: the USTA is at fault for its poorly designed dq system (there is justification for a very high strike threshold in a player's first few matches when one atypical result could dramatically affect the player's DNTRP, but it does not make sense to maintain the high strike threshold throughout the year, and instead the threshold should shrink to something at most slightly above the relevant NTRP level by playoff time). And captains are at fault for recruiting self-rated players who are way out of level -- if the USTA wanted to address this, they could keep track of which captains have players who get dq'ed during the season or during nationals, and then disallow repeat offenders from captaining again for several years. But every USTA official I have ever spoken with (across several sections) has said the USTA cares more that these captains get new players to pay the USTA money, than that the captains make skill-level based tennis less fun for existing players by forcing existing players to play against wildly out-of-level opponents.

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    1. Good points. It is in large part about the money and what the USTA thinks they can do to keep/add players playing. I just think the miss that they are losing players that get fed up with these shenanigans.

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  3. The System is a joke and subject to Human interaction for sure! I have presented several examples of self rated players winning in straight sets multiple times at the HIGHER level than rated - all for not. NOTHING DONE! It's going to be pie in the face when TEXAS wins almost every level at Men's 18+ Nationals.

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  4. I have already showed you through email earlier this summer the player on my team that won 3&3 and 3&2 against the same opponent then 3&3 against another solid but far from spectacular rating at 4.0 and was dqd. The system is a sham. In middle states jersey and Philly get away with out of line players all the time with ratings that are clearly above level. The computer ratings are a secret for a reason. Because they can pick and choose who they want disqualified. Then you see a player from east penn district at sectionals get disqualified at 4.0 who LOST matches (of course his opponent doesn't get disqualified).

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  5. Went to Nationals this year. I think there's 2 clear changes. 1. Computer players should have a lower threshold for in season bumps. A player played 3 matches in 2019 which locked their computer rating without 3 strikes. In 2021, they went 22-0, and 6-0 at nationals, mostly blowout wins. Guy was playing 3.5, but was clearly 4.5 level to anyone watching. Should he be DQ? Maybe not, but definitely should not have been allowed to play beyond regular season. #2 change is that you should not get a strike for losses. We had a player get 2 of his 3 strikes for losses at 4.0. 3rd strike was a split set super at sectionals and got DQ. He had multiple losses at 3.5 during the season.

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    1. The scenario you describe, play 3 matches as an S and get a rating, perhaps not going all out, then improve and play all out, is a problem for sure. Especially when the USTA drops the ball and doesn't publish year-end ratings for 2020. Had ratings been published, a lot of players would have been bumped up and this issue goes away.

      I can't agree with you about no strike for losses. Playing up and losing can be an indication you are a strong player. Self-rates shouldn't play up if they don't want to risk strikes and a DQ.

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  6. You can look up Mark Phillips for another example. That guy playing 3.5 is an absolute joke.

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    1. Yep. The USTA blew it in 2019, he should not have been a year-end 3.5, my ratings have him well over 3.50. Then had 2020 ratings been published, he would have been bumped up and problem solved. The USTA blew it again.

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  7. Player on my team just got dynamically disqualified from finals match at nationals 40+ 3.5. She lost the match against Florida for the championship 6th match October 17th. If it is truly the 3.5 championship how do you dynamically disqualify a player that lost? Aren't you admitting the winning teams players are way out of their league?

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    1. First, a DQ after Nationals does not mean the last match was a good result and a strike. It is possible the player had two strikes coming in and got the 3rd strike in any single match at Nationals.

      Second, yes, players at Nationals are out of level.

      Third, in doubles it is possible for a player to get a high rating in a loss if they play with a partner with a rating that isn't as high.

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  8. I had a player get dq after 3 matches pre-pandemic and several obviously in wrong divisions now in 2021. They are not dq'ing people who obviously self-rated too low. The whole thing is a mess now.

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